tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post3864565750243759638..comments2024-03-17T07:55:12.096-07:00Comments on FOFOA: Public Service AnnouncementFOFOAhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17152544684132776239noreply@blogger.comBlogger246125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-73284380197066973282013-12-17T00:32:42.369-08:002013-12-17T00:32:42.369-08:00Hi Spaul,
The numbers are for virgin metal in all...Hi Spaul,<br /><br />The numbers are for virgin metal in all cases. Right now, only about 40% of 'fresh' aluminium comes from recycling (despite a higher recycling rate), as we are still very much in the 'build up a societal stock' phase. Recycled aluminium would be much lower (some 90%) in terms of energy consumption. I don't know whether it makes sense to add recycled DASKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06123620707472590249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-68015300322014805202013-12-16T07:09:50.179-08:002013-12-16T07:09:50.179-08:00@ DASK
Excellent analysis, but we also need to go...@ DASK<br /><br />Excellent analysis, but we also need to go beyond direct energy consumption used in benefaction and refining. For example the energy in manufacturing the mining equipment or the energy needed to sustain the life of the workers (food, transportation, heating etc) numbers that are difficult if not impossible to figure out with any degree of precision. The market none the less Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-79445074397856618252013-12-16T03:31:48.063-08:002013-12-16T03:31:48.063-08:00@BH, thanks ;) It's a bit counter intuitive, ...@BH, thanks ;) It's a bit counter intuitive, that's for sure. There are few things more energy intense/$ than aluminium in society. Depending on how you treat recycling/ energy recovery, plastics and wood can be, because they have use as feedstock. If you want to hedge energy with material purchases, perhaps high quality hardwood or pure PE or PP slabs? I think plastic would be the DASKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06123620707472590249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-35148169071270683742013-12-16T03:00:30.731-08:002013-12-16T03:00:30.731-08:00Wow, DASK that's an awesome analysis.
It'...Wow, DASK that's an awesome analysis.<br /><br />It's not obvious at first thought that the prices of the metals don't reflect energy costs, but it seems the be the case. What I find amazing if the incredible amount of energy stored in everyday items that makes our standard of living so wonderful these days.<br /><br />I guess if you really want to invest in energy - just cut out Beer Holidayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05272004952129916579noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-16452741604143659652013-12-16T02:40:41.057-08:002013-12-16T02:40:41.057-08:00@Spaul, Beer Holiday
I have some reasonably good ...@Spaul, Beer Holiday<br /><br />I have some reasonably good data on energy / metal production, here is how it breaks down.<br /><br />I used data, global for a 1 g/t gold-silver deposit. Underground mines and zinc/lead/copper/silver/gold deposits are less energy intense (factor of 2 minimum). Aluminium, I took the average per kilo from the entire global supply chain. Oil is for fuel + generators,DASKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06123620707472590249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-43689165123333650312013-12-15T18:16:50.088-08:002013-12-15T18:16:50.088-08:00Public Service Announcement: A new post is up!
An...Public Service Announcement: A new post is up!<br /><br /><a href="http://fofoa.blogspot.com/2013/12/eye-for-gold.html" rel="nofollow">An Eye for Gold</a> <br /><br />Sincerely,<br />FOFOA<br />FOFOAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17152544684132776239noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-42319478696904054192013-12-15T17:47:00.135-08:002013-12-15T17:47:00.135-08:00"if you don't believe in the 'whole 2...<i>"if you don't believe in the 'whole 2 tiered gold price' (and by that we mean it moves at a higher price among central banks, correct?) then why hasn't China just snatched up even more than they have? The've got $1.3 trillion to spend, at a minimum; what is keeping them from getting closer to the 10% reserves in gold level that many countries already have (or exceed)?&Bullion Baronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10326839149017875755noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-82512151435994300052013-12-15T17:06:13.108-08:002013-12-15T17:06:13.108-08:00Jeff,
It's clear what the separation was betw...Jeff,<br /><br /><i>It's clear what the separation was between; gold and the state. The euro was made for men, for the people that use it. Not for one group of currency users (savers) to crush the other users (debtors).</i><br /><br />Are you sure this makes sense?<br /><br />1) Why have Greece, Portugal, Ireland, Cyprus, Spain (partly) been forced into internal deflation (falling wages and Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-14032480157185307122013-12-15T15:33:19.654-08:002013-12-15T15:33:19.654-08:00Spaul
Most of us who keep coming here are adults w...Spaul<br />Most of us who keep coming here are adults with real wealth to protect. The decision to buy silver (as well as other things) has been considered with much thought.<br />One mistake at this point and we could feel the pain we felt in 2001 and again in 2008.<br />Everyone must make their own calls but when it is your retirement riding on the outcome of your decisions it become a serious Michael dVhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12483224373093707424noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-41677063170517526622013-12-15T15:27:47.889-08:002013-12-15T15:27:47.889-08:00Wim Duisenberg, the first ECB president, stated th...Wim Duisenberg, the first ECB president, stated them pretty clearly in this 2002 speech: "The euro, probably more than any other currency, represents the mutual confidence at the heart of our community. It is the first currency that has not only severed its link to gold, but also its link to the nation-state. It is not backed by the durability of the metal or by the authority of the state. Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08785185950964767294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-68260390399513531722013-12-15T15:26:33.837-08:002013-12-15T15:26:33.837-08:00I was just wondering about the Cyprus situation an...I was just wondering about the Cyprus situation and thinking that some might see the evil hand of the bankers in this act.<br />One wonders if those folk even consider that there might be other reasons for the act of bail-in. One such reason might be to make it clear to the entire EZ that the ECB is not the Fed and will not allow the 'end of fiat' behavior of the Fed to be anticipated Michael dVhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12483224373093707424noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-42762298670991461672013-12-15T15:25:07.962-08:002013-12-15T15:25:07.962-08:00Wim Duisenberg, the first ECB president, stated th...Wim Duisenberg, the first ECB president, stated them pretty clearly in this 2002 speech: "The euro, probably more than any other currency, represents the mutual confidence at the heart of our community. It is the first currency that has not only severed its link to gold, but also its link to the nation-state. It is not backed by the durability of the metal or by the authority of the state. Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08785185950964767294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-77556205027885237882013-12-15T14:05:44.241-08:002013-12-15T14:05:44.241-08:00spaul:
It was this blog that convinced me to dump ...spaul:<br />It was this blog that convinced me to dump silver. I want nothing to do with it, except for of course it's known uses.<br /><br />Silver is an industrial commodity. Watch in amazement as the silverbugs dump it to get their hands on any fiat or gram of gold they can find.<br /><br />If you want to play that game, so be it. Many of us refuse to, that's the point. S Phttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02094399395379857595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-89044113002680440152013-12-15T13:33:49.006-08:002013-12-15T13:33:49.006-08:00Giants sell gold
Much much more than once
Possessi...Giants sell gold<br />Much much more than once<br />Possession is retained<br /><br />… Quite the value proposition!DPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01965423353442076871noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-83962296115752258972013-12-15T13:17:46.518-08:002013-12-15T13:17:46.518-08:00@Luke
"Whoever is selling to the giants, wou...@Luke<br /><br />"Whoever is selling to the giants, wouldn't you say they know gold will soon be valued much higher?" <br /><br />I can't presume to know who knows what. I assume 99% of shrimps that dump their physical gold or scrap jewelry for $1250 an ounce don't value gold for more than that. Maybe they do but they need to pay some fiat bills. Miners must sell to pay Samhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01397128468234177166noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-1607964995644905132013-12-15T12:08:44.469-08:002013-12-15T12:08:44.469-08:00Perhaps something BTC'ers didn't envision,...Perhaps something BTC'ers didn't envision, <a href="http://money.cnn.com/2013/12/10/technology/bitcoin-jpmorgan/index.html" rel="nofollow"><b>JPMorgan patents Bitcoin-like payment system</b></a><br />JPMorgan (JPM, Fortune 500) has also patented payment software that would latch onto your Internet browser and allow you to shop without pausing to fill out forms with personal financial tEONhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15077920840657112941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-40383417579185910642013-12-15T11:40:50.434-08:002013-12-15T11:40:50.434-08:00I'll agree with FOA, and bet on human dynamics...I'll agree with FOA, and bet on human dynamics every time. <br /><br />FOA: I think most hard money advocates have conditioned their thought process too much. A little time away from the trading screen and into the real world where fresh air clears the mind would do them good. There is a whole planet of people out there that can use currency right along side all their other wealth to trade Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08785185950964767294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-26943626924735312532013-12-15T11:39:03.068-08:002013-12-15T11:39:03.068-08:00So who do you believe, the hard money boys who say...So who do you believe, the hard money boys who say this time they've got it right, or old FOA, who understood that it's better to give people what they want, debtors and savers. <br /><br />Further:<br />Was this really circular thinking on our part? Did the Lender of last resort exist during the 'South Sea Bubble" or the "Tulip mania",,,,,, and did the "Black Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08785185950964767294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-25375603603480905292013-12-15T11:34:15.736-08:002013-12-15T11:34:15.736-08:00There's nothing wrong with lending, even lendi...There's nothing wrong with lending, even lending for consumption. A loan is productive for the lender if it's paid back, and it's productive for the producer because it allows people to buy their products. You don't need zero inflation or even deflation to make banks accountable for lending; just separate the MoE from Sov. That's a lot easier and more acceptable to the Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08785185950964767294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-22180305839545069322013-12-15T11:24:36.311-08:002013-12-15T11:24:36.311-08:00There are no kleptocrats; there are only bankers a...There are no kleptocrats; there are only bankers and politicians responding to our desire for money, and lending. <br /><br />FOA: When you and others say """ FIAT HAS NEVER BEEN THE CHOICE OF THE PEOPLE ACTING IN COMMERCE OF THEIR OWN ACCORD """ ,,,,,this is true.<br /><br />This is true, but this was never the thrust of the argument. The use of money in any contextJeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08785185950964767294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-10870316798655375352013-12-15T11:17:47.224-08:002013-12-15T11:17:47.224-08:00@ Beer Holiday
Most aluminum is recycled thus its...@ Beer Holiday<br /><br />Most aluminum is recycled thus its energy storage potential is diminished by this fact. I’m not necessarily suggesting this or that commodity, only what characteristics it should have vs. a Freegold price which by definition will be priced significantly higher in terms of energy and thus by extension all other commodities than it is now. I thought that was the whole Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-76433996500221994962013-12-15T11:02:44.568-08:002013-12-15T11:02:44.568-08:00@Gary (tEON)
"if you hated the old system, y...@Gary (tEON)<br /><br />"if you hated the old system, you won't like the new one either" - Another<br /><br />I agree this is exactly why we need to cover our bets. <br /><br />Think for a minute; he said this knowing full well what Freegold represented. Now in the mind of a libertarian/net producer Freegold sounds pretty good for all the reasons I stated vs. the current system Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-4702346664437729142013-12-15T10:32:01.301-08:002013-12-15T10:32:01.301-08:00Sam
Whoever is selling to the giants, wouldn'...Sam<br /><br />Whoever is selling to the giants, wouldn't you say they know gold will soon be valued much higher? Surely you don't believe they are so short sided as to sacrifice being a monetary power in the coming monetary system for a few short years of status quo. <br /><br />Do you believe the giants are buying at a higher price or are only valuing the gold at a higher price?https://www.blogger.com/profile/13027904936483106551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-5469780227977676972013-12-15T09:56:21.281-08:002013-12-15T09:56:21.281-08:00Knotty Pine:
Thank you! I will re-read this. The...Knotty Pine: <br /><br />Thank you! I will re-read this. The highlighted quote in the post fits well with all the macro events which are leading to a collapse in US currency. Both events described below are occurring more rapidly these days it seems?( Less structural support and money printing.)<br /><br />From the post: <br /><br />"It is about a currency that has reached the end of its Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03254546867681324113noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4490468598422095060.post-59299438570039272312013-12-15T09:51:26.874-08:002013-12-15T09:51:26.874-08:00Hi Josh R, welcome,
This post might be a good ch...Hi Josh R, welcome,<br /><br /><a href="http://fofoa.blogspot.com/2012/05/inflation-or-hyperinflation.html" rel="nofollow">This post </a> might be a good choice for you (I am re-reading it now as well). Remember FOA's famous quote:<br /><br />"My friend, debt is the very essence of fiat. As debt defaults, fiat is destroyed… hyperinflation is the process of saving debt at all costs, even Knotty Pinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02879313898299082891noreply@blogger.com