Friday, August 23, 2013

Five!


My Candid View – Part 10



"Did you have a "simple yet profound" A-HA moment you wanted to discuss?"

Ah, yes… my aha moment.

Well, FOFOA, it may be an errant aha moment, but here it is:

I had thought that the paper gold market was tethered to the physical market, and, while it is, it is not tethered to it the way that I imagined it was. In posts I had asserted that the paper market needed physical, but not vice versa, I was right, but for the wrong reason. I was thinking that paper gold required physical to meet the occasional allocation requests that came along…from anyone asking for physical. But allocation requests from small fry, (even not so small fry) that aren't met, shall we say, in a timely way, are not of the sort that can leave the paper gold market in ruins.

When you wrote the following to XXX...

"Freegold is a top-down phase transition, IMO. The minute there is not enough physical gold flowing at the top level in which it flows, the phase transition will be complete. It will be instantaneous, and when it happens there will be no going back."

somehow the genuine picture came into view as it was intended to. The paper gold market will collapse when the top level doesn't get allocation, because, when the top level can't get the goods, a revaluation is what will be required in order to get gold in size to flow. But, by definition, the ice dam will be so thick that a massive charge will be required to break that dam up to a degree that will achieve the desired result.

The top tier not getting physical will require something like a Def Con 1 response. The bombers will have to be let loose and the world as we knew it can never be the same again.

The process of getting physical in that size to flow will require something so forceful, so monumental, that the paper market must be, as a part of the proceedings, annihilated. Paper gold will be reduced to ashes on a launch pad that will be propelling physical gold beyond the gravitational pull that holds it in lock step with all the other actual commodities. The moment the top tier cannot source physical, the paper market is a dead man walking because nothing less than paper gold's sacrifice will get gold flowing to the necessary degree. Let me know if I am on target or not.

Hello Edwardo,

Yes, I think you've nailed it! But let me try to walk you through a little more detail (i.e., add a little more resolution and color to your view)…

Have you ever noticed that sometimes your local dealer has a lot of old coins, and then at other times he has mostly (or only) the latest year Eagles and Maples? I have personally dealt with maybe a half dozen different dealers in person, and I have noticed this on a couple different occasions. Remember when I kept mentioning a flow chart while we were Skyping? It looks like a family tree, kind of like this:



In this chart, the "Me" at the top would be the top level where gold trades in the largest volume amongst Giants, CBs, SWFs, and large wholesalers. So the "Me" would be the LBMA (in combination with the assistance of the BIS) and the Mom and Dad would be the largest wholesalers as well as the CBs (because Giants and SWFs generally don't "on sell" their gold purchases. At least that's not their reason for purchasing). The Grandparents would be the lower level wholesalers. The Great Grandparents would be the dealers that you and I know, including thousands of small dealer you will only find at coin shows, and then there would be another level of Great Great Grandparents that would be us "shrimp end users".

When your dealer is mostly stocked with old coins, the gold is flowing right here within our own level. Some other shrimp has sold his gold to a dealer and now you are buying it from a dealer. But if there are more buyers than sellers at the paper price, then the dealer has to go up this flow chart to find sufficient supply. Perhaps the shortage you observed is just localized, confined to your area, but in some other areas there are more sellers than buyers. In that case, the "Grandparent" wholesaler will supply old coins acquired from another locality. If not, he'll have to go higher up the flow chart to the CB's mint, and that's when you'll see mostly new coins at your dealer. The first time I saw this was in early Oct., 2008, but I've noticed it lately as well. One dealer I called who doesn't use wholesalers was completely out of stock (more buyers than sellers), and another one I saw at a coin show last month had only brand new 2013 coins. He had bought them from his wholesaler who received them from the mint.

So that's how the physical market works. It is fractal in that different levels operate basically the same only on different scales. And the physical market uses the reference price from the paper market which means that the various states of flow around the physical market are disconnected from the price-discovery market rather than being an integral part of it.

As I just stated, I did call one dealer last month who had no inventory at all at today's low paper market price. But obviously my personal experience didn't leave the paper gold market in ruins. Another example is that, just today, Jim Rickards tweeted that his dealer (presumably on the east coast) is out of gold. Nickz immediately tweeted back that his dealer (on the west coast, who incidentally is also a wholesaler) has plenty. Then he tweeted that the "supposed tightness" in the physical market is "gold bug fiction"… tweet.

This is the same thing we hear from XXXXXX and XXXX, that if they aren't seeing it in their little corner of the physical market, then it doesn't exist. It therefore must be fiction created by gold bugs to sell their gold bug hype. The problem with that view is that there's no cohesive and coherent narrative to explain their view of plenitude. And it also leaves them with only the consensus view to explain the unusual draining of GLD. All three of them have professed, in no uncertain terms, their rejection of the coat-check room view, but I digress.

The point was that Jim Rickards' tweet didn't leave the paper gold market in ruins either. And as I said, when the flow is tight at our shrimp level, we tend to see more current-year coins directly (or indirectly through large wholesalers) from the mints. The CBs have large reserves of gold, and they regularly send small amounts to the mint which is generally enough to keep the shrimp demand supplied whenever the shrimp level of the physical market fails to supply itself with old coins. And the countries that don't have large reserves, like Canada and Australia, have sufficient flow coming out of their mines which is essentially the same thing as having a large reserve.

So, to some extent, our shrimp-level demand shocks are isolated from the top level supply chain by the CBs and their mints. As long as the paper market is still functioning, any physical shortages we are able to identify at our level will likely be localized and mostly immaterial to the timing of the inevitable collapse. These localized shortages are symptomatic of the overall tightness and the failure of the paper market to keep physical gold flowing properly, but their relevance to the timing will only be known in hindsight. As I said, I saw it happening back in 2008, so their value is not predictive in nature.

But here's the main thing… A properly functioning physical gold market is one in which each level of this flow chart pyramid more or less supplies its own demand, and any differential between supply and demand, meaning the margin of that particular level that must reach up to the next level of volume in order to satisfy demand or unload excess supply, transmits a price signal that makes its way up the pyramid. The transmitted price signal is a premium difference between localities that allows higher-volume arbitrageurs to move the gold to where it needs to go while making a profit from doing so, just like what I wrote above where the "Grandparent" wholesaler will supply old coins acquired from another locality. This is how the gold physically flows from one locale to another, and the higher up the pyramid, the larger the volumes and distances.

That's the way it should work. The more gold that flows at the bottom levels, the less that needs to flow at the top. Yet the top receives—through the dealer network—the aggregated price signals from the various "bottom" locales and so the "top level price" where gold is moving in the largest volumes becomes the reference price used at the bottom. If demand for gold is high in your locality (i.e., your area is running a trade surplus excluding gold), there will be a higher premium locally than elsewhere, and so someone higher up will bring in some physical gold from elsewhere. Simple as that!

Today, however, this natural system isn't even functioning. No gold price signals are transmitted from the lower levels to where the price is discovered because the price is discovered in the paper gold market. The CBs could potentially supply the bottom level for quite a while. So why don't they? Well, it must be much more than just the bottom level that matters, because what we learned from ANOTHER was that they were very worried about this flow as far back as 1979, so they formulated a temporary plan.

They could have run down their reserves by minting small coins forever to keep the shrimp gold bugs satisfied, but apparently there were larger interests who couldn't possibly be satisfied with mint tubes and monster boxes. So they tapped the mines. Annual mining supply in 1985 was 1,500 tonnes. If ANOTHER knew what he was talking about and the CBs were hoping for a 5-fold increase, that means the (temporarily) sustainable flow, as viewed from the top where we cannot see, must be around 7,500 tonnes per year at current ratios (notice I didn't say "prices" because, even though the POG has changed since 1985, the ratios with commodities haven't). With very little basic math, that leaves a huge shortfall pressure on the physical gold market today, in the range of some 100,000+ tonnes of physical that was expected or at least hoped-for (promised to someone?) but never delivered.

Think about that for a minute. Hmmm… How did FOFOA come up with that number? Hmmm… Is it meant to be sensationalistic hyperbole or a very conservative back-of-the-envelope calculation? Hmmm…

It's conservative.

So just think about how long the CBs could prolong the status quo ratios with their mere 30,000 tonnes if that was their goal. It's not their goal, so you can stop thinking now. ;D

The point is that the "marginal drain" from all levels combined has reached the very top of the pyramid and is now draining its reserves. This is not the way the physical gold market should work. The CBs announced in 1999 that they would no longer support this constricted flow under the current market structure. Today, as the CBs are increasing their physical gold reserves in aggregate, they are once again telegraphing the message that there is no support for the status quo from the CBs, even as they continue to mint shrimp coins due to tradition.

So once those reserves at the top are gone, what happens?

"The top tier not getting physical will require something like a Def Con 1 response. The bombers will have to be let loose and the world as we knew it can never be the same again."

Yes. But do you see how the Def Con 1 response has a lot of moving parts and detailed resolution? We can't know exactly what has transpired at the top, except for what ANOTHER alluded to. But just imagine that 100,000+ tonnes of promised or at least expected gold (that's marginal-flow-gold, not global-stock-gold, so a simple doubling of the price would never suffice) never flowed. Once the top stops supplying the top as well as all lower levels, what would it take to get physical moving again for those that apparently mattered even as far back as 1979?

Remember, at that top level you have a variety of different players, but they generally fall into two types. I would categorize the two types as "savers" and "dealers". The "savers" include the CBs, SWFs, Giants and oil producers, and the "dealers" are the bullion banks and the largest wholesalers—the "arbs" that will move gold in volume from the lower premium zones to the higher premium zones for profit. These dealers don't care about the price. They don't own the gold, they only move it for profit. The top-level "savers", on the other hand, do own the gold and do care about the price. But most importantly, they have no reason to sell any gold, and every reason to buy more.

These are the CBs who can print, the sovereign wealth funds that are tasked with spending surplus currency and the Super-Producers who, until they stop producing, have no reason to sell any gold. And there's no level above this top level for the top level dealers (the bullion banks) to reach up to for more supply. When the top-level dealer supply runs out, the only place to go for more supply is to the demand side, to those who want more and have no reason to sell what they already have.

Can you see the dilemma? The price of gold will still be the paper price, but the flow will have completely stopped at the top level. It will be a de facto failure of the paper gold market and a new price separate from the paper gold market will be required to get it moving again. It will be like gridlock in a big city. The lights keep changing from green to red to green again but nothing moves. The system has failed, and only a revaluation can get it moving again. My gridlock is your ice dam.

At a high-enough price (in real terms, meaning a revaluation), those with gold *IN SIZE* who have no reason to sell any and simply want to buy more will only have to sell a small percentage of their "savings" to unlock the gridlock (melt the ice) and get it all moving again which will, in short order, allow them to resume "saving" once again. But gridlocks don't just unlock themselves, so someone will have to act first. And here's where it gets interesting.

What is the price that will unlock the gridlock at the top level, convincing those who have no reason to sell and every reason to buy more to sell? Who can act first, and what would that action necessarily entail? Here's what I think. The first to act would have to not only understand what is happening, but also be willing and able to sell or buy any amount of gold. This eliminates the Giants, SWFs and oil states because, even though they have plenty of gold, they don't have the printing press the way the CBs do. And that's why I think the CBs will be the first to act, probably under the auspices of the BIS.

In order to break the gridlock, they will have to announce a very high spread, a bid price and an ask price, either of which can be voluntarily accepted by the other top "savers", the Giants, SWFs and oil states, or "arbed" by the top "dealers". It would look something like this: "We will buy any amount of your gold that you are willing to sell at a price of $55,000 per ounce, and we will sell you any amount of gold that you would like to buy at a price of $56,000 per ounce." How's that for a Def Con 1 response?

Here's the key. Which do you think you need to lend credibility to a really high revaluation price, a buyer or a seller? The answer is you need a buyer, and not just any buyer, an unlimited buyer. The physical gridlock requires a physical seller to unlock it, but the revaluation that will make that happen requires an unlimited buyer. So the "first to act" can't just be a willing seller at a high, revalued price, it must also be a willing buyer at that same price and in any quantity offered.

Remember this post from ANOTHER (THOUGHTS!)? This Def Con 1 response would be quite similar to the pre-euro potential oil-bid-for-gold scenario in that post. So I will rewrite a small part of it using simple word replacement to show you how it would work:

"The first few moments after the BIS's proposal to buy gold at the very steep price of $55,000/oz, there would be roars of laughter. One fast thinker after another would think "Hey. I buy some gold from APMEX at $1,300/oz, sell it to the BIS for $55K. Net profit is $55,000-$1,300=$53,700. Easy money."

Everyone at once turns to the shrimp and paper gold markets to buy, markets which promptly shut down. Now no one is laughing. Because everyone realizes that gold is now worth $55,000 per ounce and no one is prepared for that revaluation. Whoever has gold now has 42.3 times the purchasing power in that stockpile. What appeared to be a stupid offer has now become a complete revaluation of all gold stockpiles worldwide vs all currencies worldwide."


The point is that the credible bid alone is enough to shut down the paper markets and stop all shrimp transactions at the old price in their tracks. The top level price is now the reference price used worldwide. The first transactions will be sales to the BIS, but before you know it, cash4gold arbitrageurs all over the world will be buying any and all physical gold offered for, say, $54,000/ounce just to arb that $1,000/oz. spread. Before you know it, the new physical-only market will have emerged worldwide.

So there's your Def Con 1 response to gridlock at the top level in which physical gold flows.

I think the draining we see today at the top via daily GLD inventory updates is just buying enough time to divvy up the few remaining scraps. At some point you're giving away the scraps by buying more time to divvy up the scraps, so where's the point of diminishing returns? Is it now? Is it next week? Who knows? We can only guess at such "hypothetical" choices.

If I'm right about the meaning of the GLD drain, then we're already in that zone where someone is asking, "Now?" "Now?" "Now?" with a loaded pistol aimed at the suffering animal's head. The physical market is no longer functioning properly, nor is it being supported. It is instead like a body in the last stages of starvation, eating its own extremities while hoping for some kind of a merciful reprieve. Each bite out of GLD is like a crazed animal eating its own tail, or arm, or leg. ;D

Sincerely,
FOFOA

Hi FOFOA,

Thank you for that very illuminating added color and detail. The last few paragraphs of your epistle really hammered home the "state of play". The system has become cannibalistic.

The main coin and bullion dealer that I used to go through here in town, a dealer who had been in business in town for many years, closed down a little over a year ago. I never received a very satisfactory answer as to why he closed when he closed other than burnout. Now his nephew operates a shop on a substantially smaller scale, and for many months, whenever I have contacted him to find out what the cheapest premium coins are in stock, the only response I have received is the thin gruel of MLs, GEs and the occasional Kruggerand and 1 ounce bars.

Now for a mini-digression of my own. My sister and her family were visiting us this weekend and I showed her the RT interview. In the last few months, I have finally persuaded her to buy some physical, and, now, after this weekend-where we discussed matters related to the interview- she is acquiring more. Unfortunately, My father is pretty much intractable which is a shame, but C'est la vie.

Edwardo
_____________________

And finally, here's one last bonus email for you. Unlike the others, this one is not from the last 30 days. I wrote this one back in February, a month and a half before the big gold price crash in April, while the PoG was still barely above $1,600:

Hello FOFOA - I started off this week-end feeling very gloomy. But then your Checkmate Post hit the streets - and boy did that cheer me up!! What a feast! Funnily enough I was going through some older posts again, trying to make sure I understood each and every one of your Catch-22 scenarios. I think I "get" them all now, and the Checkmate Post just put the icing on the cake.

So you "expect it soon" - and if you had to bet on the "what triggers it" question - what do you see as the "most likely" trigger? I'm sure you ponder this often, and I'm also sure you have already selected your most likely or most appealing "favourite". So how would you like to see the game end?

Cheers - XXXXXX

Hello XXXXXX,

I think the biggest threat to the system right now is price volatility. That is, prices of real things changing too quickly in either direction. Prices are where the rubber meets the road, where the monetary plane intersects the physical plane. And I view gold as the linchpin that ultimately holds the two planes together.

I think the "most likely trigger" is the price of gold falling too fast, simply because I can imagine that happening at any moment, with little or no warning. It could easily be accompanied by (and driven by) a general market collapse like we had in September of 2008, or it could happen on its own for lack of support from either of the two legs. By looking at the gradually falling price around Snapshot days, I am simply taking note of the apparent lack of levitation we've seen in the past, which could mean that official support has ended if it was ever present in the first place.

Of course technical support levels still come into play even if the bull run has ended, so I think it is most likely to be accompanied with some sort of a general market decline. If there's a general market crash that punches gold downward through some of those technical support levels, there may be nothing below to stop the fall. That's when the paper price separates from the physical price IMO.

So will it happen this year? What are the odds that we make it through the rest of the year without a "dramatic correction" in the markets?

If the bull run continues, a rising price is also a threat because the general price level of commodities (real things) is correlated with gold during a bull run. The USG's spending habit is another place where the rubber meets the road because the USG's addiction is in real terms but its spending is in nominal terms. If "gold" goes to Jim Sinclair's $3,500 and oil follows it up north of $200/bbl, that means some real "cost push" price inflation as Jim likes to say.

Take a look at the US national debt during the last decade's bull run. It was at about $6T when the bull run started. Today it's over $16T. I don't care about the absolute level of the debt (what I call the stock), I'm only interested in the nominal rate of deficit spending (the flow), which, because it is in real terms, must accelerate with inflation. In other words, if the price of oil doubles, so does the rate of USG deficit spending, and these days that will mean the rate of QE.

I believe this will have a feedback effect on commodity prices as the USG refuses to cut its rate of deficit intake in real terms which would otherwise be the natural response to a jump in prices. I think that part of the reason we made it through the last decade's bull run was that China, while running a trade surplus, absorbed (sterilized) a large part of the USG's accelerating dollar output. But as has been observed, that mostly ended a year and a half ago, about the same time as the bull run in paper gold peaked.

So once again we have two legs of support which could explain the last decade. Somehow the flow of physical gold was managed while the acceleration in the USG's rate of dollar output was absorbed by a net-producer. And now we find ourselves stuck between a rock and a hard place. The rock being a falling gold price and the hard place being a continued bull run.

While the feedback effect on commodity prices is merely an academic exercise to us now, I think that in reality it could happen a lot faster than you can imagine.

So there you have it. My "most likely trigger" is a falling gold price which leads to the separation of paper from physical. And my "back up trigger" is a rising gold price which leads to impending hyperinflation. Both ultimately cause the other to happen in short order, but which comes first remains a question.

Remarkably, the bull run has stalled out for a year and a half now, along with oil, silver and just about everything else. So it seems we have reached a new plateau of stability. Or not. And if not, just imagine the pressure that has been building during this so called "consolidation phase". What if we bust out of this slump to the upside like July and August of 2011? Do you think it will stick? Do you think the bull run can continue to $3,500? I don't.

Do you think the general markets can continue their upward trend without a sudden and dramatic correction at some point? I don't. Do you think that official support for paper gold as well as the paper gold bull run has ended? Looking at the evidence, I think it's possible. Remember, we had Paulson and Soros selling in December along with my bellwether ringing followed by a chorus of others. Today we hear talk of technical levels of support. So what? They have those in bear markets too. Do you think the East has lost its taste for physical? Do you think the East is instead prepared to soak up the USG's accelerating rate of dollar output indefinitely? I don't. Do you think it has already ended? I think that QE is the proof that it has.

So when I say soon, what I really mean is "overdue". Like the Big One. I use this only as an example of what overdue means. These "Big One" earthquakes have a certain historical geographical frequency of, say, 70 years. So once the 70 years has passed, we could say the next one is overdue. In the case of Freegold it's not about the historical frequency. It's about all of the identifiable elements being in place. Seems to me they are now in place, so that's what I mean by "soon". Unlike most people (apparently), I don't view the more time that passes as a sign that it's farther away than we thought. That someone has figured out a new and better way to delay the inevitable. Instead, I view each day that passes as another day the Big One didn't hit even though it's already overdue.

It's one thing to explain how we made it through the last 10 years. It's something entirely different to have a gut feeling (based on what??) that it can be repeated, even as we see clear evidence that the European gold sales have ended, QE has begun (meaning not enough net producers mopping up the dollar sewage) and paper gold languishing 16% below its high from 18 months ago. I mean, seriously, anything other than "soon" would be a disservice to everyone. I don't think the actual date of Freegold exists, even with theoretically perfect (godlike) knowledge it doesn't exist. What exists is a probability wave in which "soon" has the highest probability at present.

Sincerely,
FOFOA
_____________________

We are, today, at the very conclusion of a fiat architecture that is straining to cope with our changing world… Trained from birth, as all Western thinkers are, to read everything economic in dollar system terms; we, too, are all straining to understand the seemingly unexplainable dynamics that surround us today.

Western governments, the public and several schools of economic thought are attempting to define and explain what extent these changes will have within our financial and economic world. Most are all striving to see this as the next plateau of dollar integration, carrying us onto the next level; looking always higher for what this next level will bring in social, financial and lifestyle enhancements…

What if the last decade's efforts to prolong dollar use, both internally and worldwide, have inflated its worth to such an extent that it's now vastly overvalued? Asking more; what if the architects of a competing currency system and the major players that helped guide its internal construction, all took a hand in promoting the dollar's extended life, its overvaluation and its use; so as to buy time for this great transition in our money world?

The actual debt machine that built much of America's lifestyle is now going into reverse as it destroys its own currency; one built upon a stable debt system with locked down gold prices…

To compete in the new architecture of a Euro System currency, unrestrained trading of gold will (and has) advance its dollar and Euro price significantly…

This not only has "everything to do with a gold bull market", it has everything to do with a changing world financial architecture. And I have to admit: if you hated our last one, you will no doubt hate this new one, too. However, everyone that is positioned in physical gold will carry this storm in fantastic shape. This is because the ECB has no intentions of backing their currency with gold and every intention of using gold as a "free trading" financial reserve. None of the other metals will play a part in this.

-FOA

I (we) expect none of you to consider anything said here as credible. Everything is given as I understand it. If you came with a notion that I am someone who sees the future, grab the children and run far away. For these Thoughts, and my ongoing commentary, are meant to impact exactly as the "gentleman" said they would. People hear them, and whether believed or not, the words leave a mark. A mental mark on the trail, if you will. And later, after the world turns, our little "stacks of rocks" will be easier to understand next time you are passing this way. In fact, your ability to find your own way will forever be enhanced for having seen this path in a different light.
-FOA

_____________________

Moneyness

FOA: My friend, our message and our position is that we are in one of the most exciting times of all the history of gold! We have seen that during times with the most radical transitions, the majority are usually defending the wrong asset. This unfortunate situation need not impact everyone today. If better judgment is the result of a full understanding, then some who read here will be exposed to tools that could help them avoid the mistakes of our Western hard money majority.

For Western Gold Bugs today, their culture, their system and their recent knowledge is all ensconced within the last 30 years of paper wealth. Yet they are using a hard money defense, written by masters preceding our modern era. They struggle to use that logic out of context, as it is thought to apply to this gold market today. These two precedents are leading them to reflect their gold values in some form other than physical ownership in possession. This mistaken detour from gold's true purpose will once again prove, by reality, the value of owning real gold.

Standing aside this group is the Physical Gold Advocate. For them, for us, these times will contain the greatest gain in real wealth ever seen. For those who are falling behind, gold is still within your grasp.

TrailGuide


From Moneyness, here's How It Ends:



What is Freegold?

264 comments:

«Oldest   ‹Older   201 – 264 of 264
Unknown said...

I agree with Biju in his assessment that the smuggled gold will result in cheaper (vs Exchange Prince) price. The reasons are simple - no taxes, fees, etc.

Here's one more food for thought - the govt of India has confiscated/caught about 5% of smuggled gold, and it is worth a decent sum of money - where did these gold go? If my theory is correct - the confisctors could sell these for profict (to be split by several parties) and since it costs ZERO, why not sell it for 10-30% below official exchange prices - for fast liquidation.

How about COMEX $1400 gold today, and your local coin store will sell gold to you for $1260, or $1120, or even $980 - would you not buy? And it is real .999 gold!

Unknown said...

Another Friend,

Why should Goldman Sachs be afraid of GLD? They can buy and take delivery ... whereas small fries like me cannot.

Unknown said...

MdV,
MK certainly doesn't seem today as he did back in Another's thoughts. The point being (as we seem to agree) that one's thoughts do seem to change over time.

We have seen it in many cases within these comments and even to a certain extent with our host over time.

But the core idea that gold has a specific monetary utility, through its universal agreement as the perfect medium for that utility, cannot be in question if one is to claim to be a true adherant to FREEGOLD.

The Western way of thought seems a most influencial tool to convince the many that a beviourist model of perception management, coupled with a fractionalized, rehypothecated paper proxy derivative of gold's collective trader / speculator / gamer "thoughts" ... proves a compelling counter argument.

It seems to be the sand storm that wears against the foundation of gold to cause the many to wonder if the constructs of men have replaced gold's historic function, that we have somehow finally evolved past that to a point where "the developed's disreguard for gold" can will it to be worth less, as all people from every walk of life will eventually be shown to trust in paper ... and shit like that.

It's a kind of neo-fascist, Keynesian behaviorist, globalized-interdependence-cosmic blob of mind fuck that holds back the inevitable, for as long as it has.

Unknown said...

In other words ... we already tried that -- in the most fantastically devised version of that system imaginable -- and it worked for nearly a century.

And look at where we are today. Right back to square one. Needing gold to resume it's function again.

Silly Westerner's, tricks are for kids.

Unknown said...

VtC,
As for options, I think it's agreed the dollar is the last thing to try to protect. It seems to do a good enough job of protecting itself.

It's hubris to tell Kyle they could "kill it". Those dolts couldn't kill it if they tried, and they're trying their damnedest every day.

So I hope that helps to also answer the question of why Goldman's plowing into GLD.

Brad said...

Please forgive a potentially ignorant question:

How can gold be valued at $50,000+ if it costs a tenth of that or less to mine it? If you say it will cost $50,000 to mine it, then oil will be $4,000 a barrel, and you're just talking about inflation, which is what I understood freegold does not take into account for the $50,000 estimate.

Aaron said...

Brad said...

How can gold be valued at $50,000+ if it costs a tenth of that or less to mine it?

Hi Brad-

Making some thing "money" is to overvalue that thing beyond its commodity use, specifically for the purpose of encouraging people to use it as "money" and not just another commodity.

Why don't we melt our US nickels down into their component metals and sell the metals on the open market? Because the metal has more value when we use it as minted money! Well, not so anymore with US nickels, but it once was.

How much does it take to "mine" cotton pulp?

The price of a 100% cotton shirt isn't very expensive where I live, but take some of that same cotton, add fancy ink to it and call it "money" and the price of that cotton goes through the roof!

See the difference?

Same thing with gold in Freegold.

Delusional Investing said...

Hi Brad,

Imaging that, as a backup system to using book entries and gold, the BIS also used marbles to track their (CB & giant) customer's account balances - shuffling marbles between jars to track the wealth of the world. What value does a marble now represent?

Brad said...

Sorry Aaron, that made no sense. $2000 gold plus magic equals $50,000 gold is all you said. Utter nonsense.

Delusional Investing.

Why use someone else's marbles when you can make/mine your own?

Your yearly salary is equivalent to an ounce of or you can spend 40 hours a week prospecting and make many times that.

You guys make no sense. I'm tempted to say you're delusional.

Brad said...

Aaron, if you overvalue something, people will find a way to get it at the ACTUAL cost.

If I can prospect for gold and get a few ounces, each worth $50,000 ever year, why the hell would I work in a stuffy office and get paid just $50,000, enough to only buy 1 ounce?

It's not logical. Its anti-capitalist. It's anti-freemarket, and thus won't work.

If you can give me a intelligent explanation, I'll consider it.

tEON said...

@Brad

If you can give me a intelligent explanation, I'll consider it.

Firstly, I'm sure NO one here gives a crap what you 'consider' or don't 'consider'. You seem to be under some illusion that people here that are polite enough to respond you are obliged to educate you.

Under FG, miners, large and small, will either be government controlled (Nationalized), or highly taxed. Yes, both are not very 'free-market' - so what? The consensus is the former. I would expect raw gold (that you've prospected yourself - yuk yuk) may be pretty difficult (or even illegal) to exchange and hence quit your office job. If you are prospecting for minted assayed coins or the like you may do well. Best of luck with that and RTFB.

Ken_C said...

Brad

You seem to think that mining your own gold is an easy thing to do. Well let me tell It is NOT. I have done and continue to do some placer gold mining. Mining is already highly regulated by both Federal and State. First you have to have place to mine that has gold. In the US at least if a property has gold, is accessible and is legal to mine you can bet that it already has a claim staked on it. You had best not try to "claim jump" as this will make your mining activity very short lived.

Even now before Freegold mining is highly regulated. After Freegold you can expect even more regulation. Exactly what that looks like I am not sure anyone knows.

Brad said...

gary
I like how asking an logical question gets a beliggerent and nonsensical response from what appear to be cult members.

So basically, the first rule of freegold is to not question freegold.

So instead of a phoney fiat system, you want an authoritarian regime that bans individual gold mining. What's the punishment, death? Gassing the illegal mining camps?

So we nationalize miners. What about South Africa. Why would they nationalize? They can keep pumping out gold at current rates, and use their abundant gold to buy up all the assets in the world.

Oh wait, their immense wealth now raises prices and the market reaches a new equilibrium with the prices of all other goods inflated up with the inflated $50,000 price of gold.

This is ECON 101.

Seriously, I liked the IDEA of freegold, but so far, three people have attempted to reply to my original questions, and so far, no rational response, at least nothing that conforms to economic reality.

And I'm not going to read a whole FOFOA post. They are pointlessly long.

Brad said...

"Exactly what that looks like I am not sure anyone knows."

Exactly. Because it's a pipe dream.

If you jack up the price of gold to $50,000, and you make it a crime to mine on your own, you will create a crime wave. Instead of a brutal war on drugs we'll have a war on miners.

And if any countries don't regulate their miners we'll go to war with them.

Do you even think about what you're writing?

C'mon people, I thought there was SOMETHING to this thing, and that I didn't get it simply because I wasn't willing to read FOFOA's longwinded posts, but your responses are beginning to convince me that freegold is a cult, and you guys don't know ECON 101.

It's just another get rich quick (eventually) pipe dream.

At least it seems this way. C'mon, if there's anything to it, you people can do better.

Sam said...

@Brad

Judging by the intellect and thoughtfulness that went into your barrage of comments I'm guessing the text book in your Econ 101 book was also too longwinded for you to read. You quickly got to your specialty which is prejudging and insulting rather than reading and comprehending. You're not the first to question Freegold hoping for a quick cliff notes answer and you won't be the last. Sorry to tell you Freegold for dummies is not in print just yet.

tEON said...

@Brad

beliggerent and nonsensical response from what appear to be cult members

What you mean is that you didn't understand their answers - so instead of putting the onus on yourself - 'they' are delusional.... and now nonsensical. Must be our fault - not yours. Got it.

So basically, the first rule of freegold is to not question freegold

When you asked a polite question - did you not get polite answers? When the answers weren't to your liking, did I not respond?

What's the punishment, death? Gassing the illegal mining camps?

Gee Brad - what was the punishment for buying Gold in the US prior to Aug 71'? or holding more than 5 ounces per household? What an authoritarian regime, eh? That isn't technically free-market now is it? Consider a floating standard.

If you jack up the price of gold to $50,000

The price of Gold will not be jacked-up, Brad. It only takes the paper market to implode. $50K (or whatever) will be the price to make physical Gold flow at the top level.

They can keep pumping out gold at current rates, and use their abundant gold to buy up all the assets in the world.

Yeah, pumping out less than 1% a year. You don't see that being controlled, huh? Taxed, nationalized. You think gold at its true physical value - say $50K for now - won't be administered by a government? Perhaps envision the concept that Gold in the ground has value - without being mined?

inflated $50,000 price of gold

My, you are confused. Gold is not inflated at $50K, Brad. The paper price is inflated at anything above $0.00.

This is ECON 101

Then I suggest you have some re-learning to do. Perhaps FoFoA 101 - come back in a year after you have passed the course. Sorry, I forgot, you don't like to read - replace 'in a year' with 'never'.

conforms to economic reality

You are aware of a paradigm shift, right? That your economic reality in regards to the Gold Market could actually change... quite dramatically. Consider what the 'Free' in Freegold means....and its consequences.

And I'm not going to read a whole FOFOA post. They are pointlessly long.

Real sorry that FG can't be condensed into a KWN-sized sound byte for your consumption. And, now, I feel any response to you is also pointless.

Michael dV said...

Brad
get silver...really...you two are perfect for one another....and GLD...it is much easier than gold to hold and protect.
If you do not observe a problem with the current monetary system then why are you reading>
What brought you here?

Motley Fool said...

Brad

"How can gold be valued at $50,000+ if it costs a tenth of that or less to mine it?"

I just want to check. Are you seriously arguing for the validity of the Labour Theory of Value as espoused by Karl Marx? Is he the authority in your econ 101 textbook?

TF

Dante_Eu said...

"When you have eliminated all that is impossible, whatever remains must be the truth, no matter how improbable."
-Sherlock Holmes

(Who I believe posts here) ;-)

Dante_Eu said...

Which by the way sometimes takes 5 years. :-)

michael3c2000 said...

Clif High's latest audio lecture
includes detailed weather, climate and solar background and updates, three discussions of gold, Syria and more. There's a brief, ill-advised IMO, endorsement of bitcoin.
The audio is good even with his voice a little hoarse from roofing work that day:
Clif's Wujo
E62 - August 26, 2013 ice age, sitchen lying sob, leiderhosen, expansion events, ison, iron plume, sink holes, BTC, AU, AG
http://www.halfpasthuman.com/audio_access.html

michael3c2000 said...

My quick overview of the gold segments above- Around the third to halfway mark he debunks Zacharia Sitchin's gold, alien and Niburu theories, questions whether anything he wrote has merit, and contrasts his own Sumerian translations that indicate Sitchin was "a lying SOB". Near the three quarter mark, Clif returns to gold, citing some events this September squarely mid-month (with dates)
which he seems confident will see a spike in gold, briefly naming silver as well. He explains why he sees gold revalued and apparently reincorporated into the global monetary system at that time.

Edwardo said...

Shutdowns in mining operations are, as you may know, well underway, and slated to continue. In the meantime, this relatively recent report from Agnico-Eagle puts forth a substantially higher "all in production" cost estimate than the WGC's $1400 dollars an ounce.

Roacheforque said...

Simple answer to Brad's question: YES you may pay 4000 for a gallon of gas ... in dollars. Yes there will be hyperinflation ... in dollars ... and hyper-deflation in terms of gold.

For the twitter generation, I think the understanding that central banks hold GOLD as the only non-paper asset on their balance sheet helps. Once I understood that, it all made sense.

We aren't officially monetizing oil, or wheat. We are RE-monetizing gold alone - this does stand apart from your inflationary commodities priced in already hyper-inflated debt (dollars). We will be using gold (only) to balance global debts, not oil or corn.

Sorry I blew the 140 character limit. And welcome to the freedom of unencumbered (cult?) thought.

The place that has your perceptions managed doesn't allow that, which is the answer to why you are here.

Roacheforque said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Indenture said...

Brad: Perhaps you weren't aware but the 'Cult Members of Freegold' have the ability to answer questions. You wanted to know how gold could be priced above it's intrinsic value. You were politely provided an answer.

It is up to you to try and understand.
Be patient, be inquisitive, but please don't be rude.

Ken_C said...

Brad

No one owes you anything. I tried to respond to your question/comment about why wouldn't a person just go out and dig up their own gold.

I have experience doing just that and I tried to tell you that it is a LOT more difficult than you seem to think. Difficult in terms of rules and regulations as well as actually finding gold.

Most gold comes from the large mines and only a relatively small fraction comes from the individual gold miners. The big mines are the ones that possibly could be nationalized although I suspect that they would more likely be regulated and taxed heavily. So anything the small miners do or do not do will have only a marginal impact at best.

One last note about your comment on the South African mines; you do realize that those mines are nearing the end of their life cycle don't you?

Roacheforque said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Roacheforque said...

It also helps to understand that it is not only GOLD that is being revalued, but more importantly, more ubiquitously, even more deterministically ... DEBT will be revalued ... in terms of GOLD.

When new debt (dollar-based) is no longer accepted (supported) in the retirement of old debt (bonds, securities, other dollar denominated derivatives) it FAILS.

We see the beginnings of this in the Euro sideshow where each new issuance of debt, though it comes with new conditionalities and newly packaged terms, is still merely the servicing of old debt with more new debt.

But what will cause debt to fail? Restriction of flow at the top (CB, SWK, 400 oz. bar level?) or a credibility problem for debt (loses its relative MoE function)?

When dollars default there will indeed be "group retreat to avoid paying up" (nationalism, regionalism or dollarism) to support dollar centric (wage/production/goods and services) ecosystems. But in a global world, few products or services have no inputs from foreign energy or supply influences.

Perhaps FOFOA will be called upon as an emissary from the Freegold faction to help the Global Debt Crisis Committee, to be formed in advance of the next Bretton style global monetary conference ... to help make that determination, among the less rational minds sure to be present there, lest we make another scandalous decision that have Reuff rolling in his grave.

Sam said...

Well said Gary. The generosity of FOFOA regulars to give thoughtful responses (even to those that haven't read a single post) never ceases to amaze.

MatrixSentry said...

Brad,

Like college, there are prerequisites required in order to participate here in pursuit of a higher degree of understanding. You must have an inquisitive and open mind, capable and willing to see new and perhaps unsettling viewpoints. You must suspend disbelief and preconceived notions in order to give new theses due diligence (drop your baggage). Then you must be willing to work. You cannot understand Freegold by asking people to explain it to you in the comments section. You have to teach yourself. You have to Read The Fucking Blog (RTFB). The comments are a good place to go to find direction or to get clarification on a point.

Most importantly you must post with a degree of humility and respect.

I find you wanting of all the above, especially the last point.

Finally, when you determine some philosophy, religion, thesis, or school of thought is not for you, do you make a habit of hanging about to antagonize the poor misguided fools? If so, what does this say about you?

Many of us here understand Freegold because we have been here from the beginning. 5 years and over 400 posts. We are ready and willing to help you learn, but we will not teach you. You will get nowhere exhibiting your ass as you have already done.

RTFB.

DP said...

Welcome to the cult of assisted self discovery.

michael3c2000 said...

http://www.komando.com/columns/index.aspx?id=15123&utm_medium=nl&utm_source=column&utm_content=2013-09-01-column-end
9/1/2013 How prepared are you for a cyberattack? By Kim Komando

S P said...

We are dealing with adolescents. Think about it...it takes roughly 12 years of schooling to even prepare people to function in the modern world, and another 4-10 years after that to learn a trade or profession.

And during that entire time, very little economics is taught, and what is taught is all but useless.

People don't understand money. I'm talking about 99% of people, around the world. Unfortunately our present system has made "economic adolescents" of us all, which is proof of how successful it has been. Children can be controlled.

Only events will force understanding on people, and for most it will be too late.

Brad said...

Motley Fool. If you think it makes sense to price something at far more than the cost it takes to produce, someone else will price it lower and get all the business.

Brad said...

Phil, do you really think it's $50,000 an ounce difficult?

Motley Fool said...

Brad

I'm sorry, you are wrong. The cost of production versus selling price is only relevant insofar as it determines what is produced. Beyond that the subjective theory of value rules.

TF

Motley Fool said...

Ps. As someone earlier politely pointed out to you in example( not a great one but w/e) the cost of producing fiat currency is insignificant, yet its market value is higher. There are literally thousands of (better) examples.

Brad said...

Aaron said this:

'Making some thing "money" is to overvalue that thing beyond its commodity use, specifically for the purpose of encouraging people to use it as "money" and not just another commodity.'

The problem is that the second it's decided that it's no longer money it's no longer overvalued and you lose everything.

It seems far more likely that we'll simply use some form of electronic currency, a la bitcoin. Why create the environmental damage when we can just count bits? Most people don't want to hold their wealth in a form that is easily stolen as gold is.

Brad said...

MF

"As someone earlier politely pointed out to you in example( not a great one but w/e) the cost of producing fiat currency is insignificant, yet its market value is higher. There are literally thousands of (better) examples."

But you can't produce dollars. If you can counterfit money you can get rich quick.

But you CAN produce gold. And there's no counterfitting to be done. You can't tell one piece of pure gold from another.

Motley Fool said...

Brad

Not that I would recommend a long winded and obviously boring post, but if I did it would be Focal Point Gold.

Of course since you have demonstrated both your masterful grasp of economic theory and that you have already made up your mind, I expect doing so is beneath you. Never mind boring. Did I mention boring?

...

Willful ignorance is one of my pet peeves. If you do not feel like taking the time to educate yourself then do not try and shoulder that burden on to others shoulders. If you wish to remain ignorant, that's fine, but do so quietly. The rest of us here actually care about knowledge.

TF

Motley Fool said...

Ps. Stopping to think of one other of thousands of examples is obviously also bothersome. Or perhaps I am simply a fool, and my saying so counts for nothing. Who knows. But since we are here. Eg. Cars. (actually every item mined or produced since as i said the subjective theory of value rules, but there is one example for you)

Brad said...

I like that anyone who disagrees on a point "doesn't care about knowledge."

Motley Fool said...

Now you have annoyed me.

I think it's time to re-quote and old blog gem, posted by Aristotle.

"It would serve you better at this early stage in your development and education to come forward with questions rather than foisting your faulty assertions. There are many here (not myself among them) with the requisite grace to deal with your toxic combination of self-assurance and unfathomed ignorance. (To be sure, I may very likely be the most arrogant person you'll ever encounter, but to my credit, I actively endeavor to remain fully apprised of my limitations and tread nowhere beyond until those limiting boundaries have been diligently explored and driven outward.)

Broad yet consistent experience in this realm has brought me to the following regrettable observation...

__________ ______________ __________
The insufferable bane of the internet near and wide -- infiltrating every arena of thought and discussion -- is an indomitable cadre of hapless pedants, each wielding a false notion.
__________ ______________ __________


Woe upon us that they, so ill-equiped, deign to commit themselves to our informational salvation. With thick and stubborn skull they hammer restlessly, yearning to replace the various masonry of solid foundations and structures with the particular cancerous notion occupying (singularly, with only personal reverence) the void between their own individual ears.

The sickening thuds of these thumping heads, wasting themselves against well-established bedrock, is an unsettling and unwelcome distraction from a forum of discussants intent upon an intelligent advance of inquiry, hypothesis, assessment, and a general improvement in understanding the ruling physics and working architectures of the real world.

___________ is Golden (for some much more than others.) Carl, get you some. --- Aristotle "

Brad said...

MF, the point is, while the subjective theory rules, it doesn't refute the fact that if gold goes way up way more people will try to mine it, regardless of the legality. And due to the higher price, even formerly lousy claims will be worth it.

Motley Fool said...

I imagine there will be some of that at the start.

Unfortunately/fortunately though gold is finite. How long do you imagine this will last?

Interestingly historically the people who made fortunes from such mining was mostly not the miners themselves, but those selling mining equipment.

Brad said...

Long enough to ruin the environment perhaps.

Or as soon as Elon Musk or Peter Diamandis captures an astroid and doubles the world supply of gold.

From the wikipedia on asteroid mining:
"Planetary Resources says that platinum from a 30-meter long asteroid is worth 25–50 billion USD,[34] an economist remarked that any outside source of precious metals could lower prices sufficiently to possibly doom the venture, by rapidly increasing the available supply of such metals."

From the Planetary Resources website:
"Once we are able to access, process, and utilize asteroid water resources, mining metals becomes more feasible. Some near-Earth asteroids contain platinum group metals in much higher concentrations than the richest Earth mines. In space, a single platinum-rich 500 meter wide asteroid contains about 174 times the yearly world output of platinum, and 1.5 times the known world-reserves of platinum group metals (ruthenium, rhodium, palladium, osmium, iridium, and platinum)."

Ken_C said...

Brad Said: "it doesn't refute the fact that if gold goes way up way more people will try to mine it, regardless of the legality. And due to the higher price, even formerly lousy claims will be worth it. "

No doubt that there will be some illegal mining but as I said above the small miner only contributes a marginal amount that will not effect the big picture.

The small miner (legal or illegal) can effect his income by digging up an ounce or two but this small amount is not going to effect the world price of gold.

And by the way I know how much work it takes to dig up an ounce of gold from marginal ground using only hand tools. It is not for the lazy or faint of heart. If gold were priced at $50,000 per ounce there certainly would be more NINJA miners trying to scrape a few grams of gold from the dirt. This will not make any differnce in the big picture when giants are dealing in tons. (NINJA = No income, No job)

MatrixSentry said...

Motley,

Classic quote! Thermonuclear comes to mind.

This one is lost. Let him thump on. We will wince at the sickening thuds, thankfully not forever. He will grow weary and move on.

Indenture said...

Brad: "Why create the environmental damage when we can just count bits? Most people don't want to hold their wealth in a form that is easily stolen as gold is."

I would try reading:

Think Like A Giant and Think Like A Giant 2

Michael dV said...

25 new posts and all drearily wasted on one guy too lazy to do his own research.

Brad said...

I know, it's so terrible when someone doesn't immediately agree with everything.

byiamBYoung said...

Brad,

I'm sure there will be some who want to try and dig up their own gold. But, like many other activities that can net a big haul very quickly (bank robbery, drug trafficking, what have you), governments go to great lengths to make the activity unattractive. I bet that will happen to maverick gold hunters, too.

Just ask yourself why the central banks all over the world have gold as the only non-paper reserve asset? They have already chosen gold. It's decided.

$50,000 is an educated guess. No one knows the revalued price with precision, of course. But it will need to be much higher than it is today.

Why? I'm not the one to answer that. But the answers that satisfy many who visit here are contained in the posts.

Freegold concepts are complicated, but it's worth the effort to understand. I heartily recommend you read a few of the posts found here. Then if you have specific quarrels, speak up. Someone will no doubt know which post(s) address your concern.

Once a couple of pieces start fitting together in your mind, it gets better.

Cheers

byiamBYoung said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
michael3c2000 said...

The entities or bots joining the dissemblers, without any pretense of having participated in the initial courtesy of hearing out our host, with an open mind, cheerful anticipation, and constructive engagement, are welcome to attract all manner of replies, condolences or indulgence until TSHTF IMHO FWIW

Unknown said...

I think Brad is deliberately disagreeing and playing us for fools, but asking one question after another that he then argues to a different slant.

Think Freegold to individual miners ..... He thinks gold is just laying around to be picked up, hahaha. Or arguing about Freegold being Valued to $55,000. I know that I do not know what the revalue DATE/TIME and PRICE will be, but only that it is not us, the small microbes that decide it, but the Truly Wealthy.

Bard, if you want a quickie lesson, just go to YOUTUBE and search for BELANGP. He has 3 videos just these few days, which answers all your question regarding the CONCEPT OF FREEGOLD (although not stated as such) and he give the mat for gold to be valued at $60,000/oz today.

Unknown said...

Psssst, BRAD - don't be fooled by all this Freegold talk, about gold price going to the moon. It is not true. It is going to THE STARS !!!

Just as you stated - What if Elon Musk is going to capture and mine an asteroid and double the world gold supply? What price gold be, then?

My answer - Gold be priced at $1 million per ounce by then. How so? Well, then, since we have the technical capability for space mining, all the ETs will coming around to trade with us. Remember the movie - Cowboys against Aliens? They are going to trade gold with us. They give us - one more year of extended life - for one ounce of gold - and the bankers will buy/sell gold for $1 million per ounce at that time.

JC said...

Hey Brad, a new and long FOFOA post is now up about gold mining, will you read it and let us know what you think? We like the challenging thoughts in these parts but let's dissolve the ignorance and have a spirited debate.

byiamBYoung said...

Hey Brad,

Re reading my comment above, I thought you might quibble over the spot where I say "I'm not the one to answer that" about the gold price. Let me explain why I said that.

When I take my car to the shop because it is making a weird clunking noise, and they tell me what is wrong and what needs to be done, I understand enough to know they are on the right track.

When I get home, explaining the repair to my wife, I realize that I no longer have all of the details clear enough in my mind to paint a full picture for her. But I know that when it was explained to me, it made complete sense, even if the complexity has now scuttled my ability to explain it.

If I was all consumed by cars and their workings, I would know what the trouble and the remedy was, chapter and verse.

But I'm not, so I accept a measure of understanding that allows me to feel confident that I'm getting the truth, and am then comfortable that I am on the right path.

That's what I meant. Freegold theories are damn solid when examined. But they can be a little hard to fully explain... at least by small brained folks like me.

Life is complicated. Huge paradigm shifts are, too. I suggest you suspend disbelief long enough to absorb a bit of the theory presented here.

It might just change your view of the future. It has changed mine!

Cheers

Brad said...

Yeah, I'm a bot. How clever. Actually I was referred here who knows how. But I was interested in the freegold idea, because i already knew the economy was in trouble, and these ideas seem to be associated. But was dissapointed in the intentionally long-winded posts that don't seem to serve much purpose, and the apparent lack of an introductory post to the freegold concept.

DP said...

OMG somebody on the Interwebz is wrong!!

I should DO something! (But that simply cannot be 'move on, leave them in peace with their silly delusions'. They need my expertise and help to save them from themselves.)

Anand Srivastava said...

Brad said:

But you CAN produce gold. And there's no counterfitting to be done. You can't tell one piece of pure gold from another.

Brad, please help our Indian govt. They are not able to do anything to contain the gold demand of our people. With your powers they will be able to do so, and finally bring normalcy to our Current Account.

Please please help us. You could save us from certain Hyperinflation.

Indenture said...


For those interested in a brief summary of Freegold please try Ron M's Air-Friendly PDFs
Google

Scroll down and click on 'JR’s Suggested RPG- Freegold Reading List'
It is a pdf file
Enjoy

Anonymous said...

The paper gold shutdown scenario this article theorizes is preposterous. The "oil" and "Asian" giants have never been able to get all the gold they want. They can only convert a tiny fraction of their earnings each year. They aren't going to suddenly become screaming babies and demand everything at once.

They don't want to collapse the dollar system, because they'd be blowing up 99% of their own wealth and power. When the paper gold markets seize up, back room deals will find a solution. For all we know this happens often.

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